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Thread: Experiences with paints/gel coats??

  1. #11
    comerz1's Avatar
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    Re: Experiences with paints/gel coats??

    Wolfie,

    Thanks for the pictures! I always love seeing tasteful and well crafted classics like that. Some old memory (probably from reading Hot Rods) tells me I have heard of your Father in Law (the King of Candy sticks out). I have had several people tell me just use the base/clear I normally use but I have always heard to never do that on a boat. At the moment I have been torn between three systems and am still researching all three;

    Gel-Coat
    AwlGrip (or AlumiGrip same thing I am told)
    Imron

    My issue with all three is lack of experience. Allow me to go through each one with my concerns and maybe you guys have some input with each.

    Gel-Coat: What can I say, it's a polyester product. I have been searching for an epoxy based gel coat but so far the only ones I can find are only available in the UK. Additionally, I understand Epoxies are NOT UV stable. Which I understood the Gel Coats weren't either? Is there a way to lay down multiple colors of gel (and possible art work) without having 20mil thick tape lines?

    AwlGrip: From my understanding, AwlGrip creates it's own "clear" during the curing process. Basically a chemical process creates this thin coat of clear and if it's ever broken through the finish beneath will require TONS of maintenence. Also same concerns with tape lines as I understand this product builds very thick.

    Imron: Basically my only concern with Imron is tape lines. I have heard of Imron being used in industrial applications and being almost indestructible. I just learned DuPont (well Axalta now, no longer DuPont) offers a clear coat in the Imron line, trying to get more information on this line from my local rep.

    So this is where I am. I am going to find a suitable coating, and when I do I am going to document the process step by step with longevity reports to the masses. I'm sorry but there just HAS to be a better way here......

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  3. #12
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    Re: Experiences with paints/gel coats??

    Thanks for the links 78_Tahiti! That's a great write up and an awesome looking boat. Now I have another hull I am in love with and will search the ends of the earth for, (weak cracking voice) yay....

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  5. #13
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    Re: Experiences with paints/gel coats??

    I have been reading for DAYS on this subject, pestering tech help and sales people from pond to pond, my head HURTS! (Mommy please make the bad people go away...) LOL

    I have reached some conclusions, although I am far from done with this. I will save GelCoat for last.

    AwlGrip- Ok this is a great product, but in all reality, it was designed for airplanes, not boats. Somewhere along the way someone decided it was a good fit for marine applications. I can't argue this logic, it is a respectable and durable product. It has it's downfalls but is much more cost effective to spray vs. gel coat, especially if paying someone else to do the work. However, since I will be doing the work and I work for free (quite literally some times), I am looking for the "best" option. In my opinion AwlGrip is the "better" option. No disrespect intended for anyone sporting AwlGrip on their float!

    Imron- Ok look, I am a fan of DuPont. I have to quit that, Axalta. I have been spraying it for 10 years, it wins trophies on every one of my projects I build for customers. However, DuPont (not Axalta here), probably due to the "advice" from some unknown government agency, quit making Imron 5000. My research leads me to believe the "new" Imron is no where near as durable as the 5000 line. I am sure Imron is still a good product, and who knows what the new owner will do with it, but I can't wait, so Imron is out.

    GelCoat- Let's face it, I have had in the back of my mind all along this would most likely be the route I would go. My research has provided a LOT of information. First of all, if the surface is prepped properly, gel is next to impossible to completely screw up. Yay! Secondly, gel technology has come a loooooong way since my boat was originally built. It seems that there are many gel coats available now that are in fact UV stable. There are a multitude of colors available. Duratec makes an additive that mixes with and cures the gel properly without a wax additive. There are several levels of quality clears available, which will allow me to "bury" my tape lines between colors. The list goes on and on and on. Granted, this will require the most work to lay down and make it look right, but in the end, it will be the easiest to repair, and the most durable. The beauty of gel coat is that you can repair an area, blend into surrounding area, cut and buff and it all blends together without a blend line. I'm sold cause chit happens man.

    I am still awaiting some responses from several people with a few more questions. One of which is if there is a way for me to lay down some art work (airbrush type) in/on the finish. If not I will survive, but I like to paint everything. Once I get this answer I will update the thread. Once I am 100% settled on my product and work commences on the boat, I am going to do a step by step how to on it and post it up. May even try my hand at some you tube videos. I'm an old fart and haven't figured that one out yet. Stay tuned guys, trying to make it easier for the next guy tackling a similar project!
    Last edited by comerz1; 09-05-2013 at 05:19 PM. Reason: "cause I don't know how to properly use the space bar.

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  7. #14

    Re: Experiences with paints/gel coats??

    Quote Originally Posted by comerz1 View Post
    Wolfie,

    Thanks for the pictures! I always love seeing tasteful and well crafted classics like that. Some old memory (probably from reading Hot Rods) tells me I have heard of your Father in Law (the King of Candy sticks out). I have had several people tell me just use the base/clear I normally use but I have always heard to never do that on a boat. At the moment I have been torn between three systems and am still researching all three;
    He's been written up in Hot Rod a number of times as well as other magazines dating back to the '50s. He owns Junior's House of Color, Junior Conway. Used to work for Barris.

    As far as the different paints, AwlGrip is very similar to Imron except that it's actually made for marine applications. From what I hear, Imron will eventually allow water to seep through. That being said, a boat that is mostly on it's trailer probably won't have a big problem. It's only a problem if you have a boat that is moored in the water.

    My choice would probably be Awl Grip.
    ****Disclaimer - I'm far from being an expert so you may want a second opinion!****

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    Re: Experiences with paints/gel coats??

    One difference i noticed between gel-coat and paint with gel you dont have to be as fussy prepping the surface usually sanding to 120 grit before you spray will do the trick but all the work is on the back end wet sanding . Gel doesn't level out so orange peel is huge . I have reservations about adding patch-aids to gel to thin the viscosity , the resin supplier i get my stuff from they make it on site , they told me in simplest terms when i asked them about thinning , if they could make it thinner they would have done it years ago and using materials like Duratech high gloss additive could lead to early oxidation and a few other things that was all about chemistry . They lost me after that lol . I still have a gallon of Duratech at the ready lol . I'll be spraying gel-coat and metal flake this weekend on my CV21 , i'll have pictures up right after im done providing i dont screw it up lol .

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  10. #16
    Rob Hawes White Lightning's Avatar
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    Re: Experiences with paints/gel coats??

    Comerz1, what I'm trying to achieve is an extremely bright yellow (like it is now, in the sun it hurts your eyes it's so bright) and use a .025" hexagonal flake (bass boat, jumbo, large, different manufacturers call it different things but all agree that it's .025" hexagonaly shaped) that's buried deep enough to cut and buff. (yes I was kidding about the 20 gallons lol). What I have on there now is a PPG Corvette yellow (from NAPA) with a tangerine pearl in the clear. Sounds yummy but if it gets even a little red next to it it flops to red, I hate it, like I said, I want to stay all yellow. I can't find any bright yellow flake. Anybody....what can I do to achieve my desired end results??? Do they make a clear flake that will let the yellow come through and still be extremely sparkly?? Maybe a silver flake???
    Rob
    Rob Hawes-Anchorage Rod Works-Anchorage, Alaska
    "Alaska Hawaii, Shipping Here Is Terrible!" (AH, $hit Club)

  11. #17
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    Re: Experiences with paints/gel coats??

    Wolfie, I was going to say I thought I recalled the "king of candy" being closely associated with Barris. Jealous to say the least. Still looking at awl grip and weighing options.

  12. #18
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    Re: Experiences with paints/gel coats??

    White lightening, what product are you going back with? Just an automotive paint? Is the flake you are using a gel coat type flake? I'm thinking, depending on how and what you are spraying, using something like a candy. Lay down your heavy silver metal flake and top coat with your translucent yellow. Talk about bling, it would look awesome. Tell me where I can get some of that flake and ill see what I can do.

  13. #19
    Rob Hawes White Lightning's Avatar
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    Re: Experiences with paints/gel coats??

    This is what I've come up with so far:
    http://www.didspademetalflake.com/me...l#.UiUztNIqhmw
    I don't necessarily have a system in mind yet, that's why I'm asking lol.

    Lay down your heavy silver metal flake and top coat with your translucent yellow

    Hmmmmm, that sounds like an idea......as long as it's VERY bright yellow and has that 'bass boat sized flake' bling. Yes, I'll be spraying it. I have all the guns I need. I was thinking about blowing the flake on but the .025"X.025" hexagonal flake can go through an HVLP gun with a big enough tip.
    Rob
    Last edited by White Lightning; 09-05-2013 at 06:45 PM. Reason: BA-LINGGGGG!!!!!
    Rob Hawes-Anchorage Rod Works-Anchorage, Alaska
    "Alaska Hawaii, Shipping Here Is Terrible!" (AH, $hit Club)

  14. #20
    Team Dirt Bag NUTTZ T8er S.'s Avatar
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    Re: Experiences with paints/gel coats??

    Quote Originally Posted by White Lightning View Post
    This is what I've come up with so far:
    http://www.didspademetalflake.com/me...l#.UiUztNIqhmw
    I don't necessarily have a system in mind yet, that's why I'm asking lol.

    Lay down your heavy silver metal flake and top coat with your translucent yellow

    Hmmmmm, that sounds like an idea......as long as it's VERY bright yellow and has that 'bass boat sized flake' bling. Yes, I'll be spraying it. I have all the guns I need. I was thinking about blowing the flake on but the .025"X.025" hexagonal flake can go through an HVLP gun with a big enough tip.
    Rob
    Dude, remember "dry flake gun" shooting flake through a hvlp gun won't get you the coverage you want. Ask me how I know....
    Last edited by T8er S.; 09-05-2013 at 07:04 PM. Reason: You want it to S P A R K L E ***

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